On steering students' learning

[Tess Sluijter]

I've been avoiding an online bickering with someone on Reddit. Thought I'd put it to my co-teachers instead.

The gist of it:

• Person A asks "I have read the exam objectives, but what takes priority based off of the older exam?"
• I respond that we cannot divulge such information due to our NDAs; we cannot say what the exam focuses on or covers.
• Person A responds that they're not looking for dumps or cheat sheets, just for guidance on which topics to focus study on.
• I counter again that this is still contrary to our NDAs: everything on the objectives is fair game and the objectives provide weighting per objective.
• Person B chastises me, saying "Instructors and fellow learners can absolutely make suggestions on topics that should be focused on, like Linux file permissions".

That's where I cut out and decide not to continue.

Me personally I hard disagree with B, because that would still be using my inside knowledge to steer someone's learning. I know exactly which topics were focused on in the exams I took, but I'm not going to tell because that laser focuses the students the "the right" parts of the exam. Sure the exam objectives are supposed to be evenly used, but from experience I know certain topics will get priority.

So what's your take on this?

 

[BrianFord]

In Reddit terms, I'd say you're NTA.

That forum is (unfortunately) full of people looking for a shortcut. In my opinion, you are exactly right when you point at the exam objectives and how the topics are weighted and say, 'Look, there it is!'. Your B is looking for you to disclose something they should be learning so that they don't have to actually learn it.

 

[Jeff Strain]

I've been avoiding an online bickering with someone on Reddit. Thought I'd put it to my co-teachers instead.

The gist of it:

• Person A asks "I have read the exam objectives, but what takes priority based off of the older exam?"
• I respond that we cannot divulge such information due to our NDAs; we cannot say what the exam focuses on or covers.
• Person A responds that they're not looking for dumps or cheat sheets, just for guidance on which topics to focus study on.
• I counter again that this is still contrary to our NDAs: everything on the objectives is fair game and the objectives provide weighting per objective.
• Person B chastises me, saying "Instructors and fellow learners can absolutely make suggestions on topics that should be focused on, like Linux file permissions".

That's where I cut out and decide not to continue.

Me personally I hard disagree with B, because that would still be using my inside knowledge to steer someone's learning. I know exactly which topics were focused on in the exams I took, but I'm not going to tell because that laser focuses the students the "the right" parts of the exam. Sure the exam objectives are supposed to be evenly used, but from experience I know certain topics will get priority.

So what's your take on this?

I would look for guidance in other areas. Example:

CompTIA-published study guides and materials have exam tips and sample questions. I would advise you to have a copy or two of those around that you can use to point learners in the right direction.

My office is packed up, or I would look at my book, but I half expect to see a tip that says what Person B said. We do need to be careful and follow the rules. There is some room there as you can point them to material that will help them, which is sanctioned. Exam dumps are a no-go, but https://www.amazon.com/CompTIA-Complete-Study-Guide-220-1101/dp/1119862914 and https://www.amazon.com/CompTIA-Complete-Practice-Tests-220-1001/dp/1119516978 are fine.

 

[Jose A Ruiz Marquez]

He mentions an old exam. If that old version is still live go study those objectives, period. If the old exam is not live study the new objectives, period, End of story.

 

[Tess Sluijter]

He mentions an old exam. If that old version is still live go study those objectives, period. If the old exam is not live study the new objectives, period, End of story.

That's not what person A was asking.

Person A is asking "based on exams you have taken before, which topics take priority?". They are basically asking me to point out the specific topics which I know appear a lot on the exam. Which I feel is off-limits.

CompTIA-published study guides and materials have exam tips and sample questions.

Person B is of the opinion that I, as a teacher, am allowed to say "I have seen topics A, B and C appear a lot on the exam". And I feel that's not correct.

 

[Gregory Childers]

1. The exam objectives clearly state the topics of the exam and the percentage of questions from each domain
2. Most CompTIA exams are variable length. You could get 85 questions, or 80, or 77, or 72.
3. The questions are randomly selected from the exam bank. No two exams will have the same topics in the same order.
4. Some topics may be covered on one person's exam and completely ignored on another person's exam.

I tell them to read the exam objectives. The topics I had on my exam are completely irrelevant to the topics you get on your exam. Not that I can remember what topics I had on my exam, which I probably passed last year or earlier.

 

[Jose A Ruiz Marquez]

Person A is asking "based on exams you have taken before, which topics take priority?". They are basically asking me to point out the specific topics which I know appear a lot on the exam. Which I feel is off-limits.

If the objectives are published by CompTIA, tell them to go read them. That's what I always do.....

 

[Tess Sluijter]

The topics I had on my exam are completely irrelevant to the topics you get on your exam.

Theoretically true, but despite that I've certainly noticed a preference for specific topics when I retook an exam multiple times... And person B felt we can tell students about this... and I really don't.

 

[Rick Butler]

That forum is (unfortunately) full of people looking for a shortcut. In my opinion, you are exactly right when you point at the exam objectives and how the topics are weighted and say, 'Look, there it is!'. Your B is looking for you to disclose something they should be learning so that they don't have to actually learn it.

This is too true. These are people that are chasing the certification for the dream of actually scoring a big job, without having the experience. Sadly, this is kinda preached, "get your cert, make bigger money", so it's no surprise that there are folks out there that dream that way. But it does take hard work - which, some folks just don't want to wait for.

I tell them to read the exam objectives. The topics I had on my exam are completely irrelevant to the topics you get on your exam. Not that I can remember what topics I had on my exam, which I probably passed last year or earlier.

And you know, I really don't want people to tell me what to study or what's on the exam, where. I want to get there on my own - to say I truly earned the credential. Otherwise, that imposter syndrome that I constantly fight with in my head gets even louder.

 

[Gregory Childers]

Theoretically true, but despite that I've certainly noticed a preference for specific topics when I retook an exam multiple times... And person B felt we can tell students about this... and I really don't.

I've surveyed students who passed the most recent version of Net+ on how many subnetting questions they had.

The student who had the most reported three subnetting questions. The student who reported the fewest had zero subnetting questions.

It didn't change the way I teach. I still make certain that every single student understands subnetting completely by the end of the class.

 

[Gregory Childers]

This is too true. These are people that are chasing the certification for the dream of actually scoring a big job, without having the experience. Sadly, this is kinda preached, "get your cert, make bigger money", so it's no surprise that there are folks out there that dream that way. But it does take hard work - which, some folks just don't want to wait for.


And you know, I really don't want people to tell me what to study or what's on the exam, where. I want to get there on my own - to say I truly earned the credential. Otherwise, that imposter syndrome that I constantly fight with in my head gets even louder.

I've finally gotten better at self-analysis. I read the exam objectives and immediately know which topics I know and which ones I don't. Then I go study the topics I don't know. It made it a lot easier when I was studying for my CISSP. I only studied for a week and passed on the first attempt.

 

[Rick Butler]

I've finally gotten better at self-analysis. I read the exam objectives and immediately know which topics I know and which ones I don't. Then I go study the topics I don't know. It made it a lot easier when I was studying for my CISSP. I only studied for a week and passed on the first attempt.

I keep thinking I need to do that with the tests I take...but I never want to underestimate them...so I end up taking weeks to study, even going over topics I've read time and again.